Re: NO, DENNIS, we do NOT need a manager!

To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
Subject: Re: NO, DENNIS, we do NOT need a manager!
From: "Bob Plank" <bobplankmail@aol.com>
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2009 15:47:05 +0000
Sensitivity: Normal
This discussion is losing perspective and becoming dangerously personal. Gentlemen, please. Bob
Bob Plank - man on the move.

-----Original Message-----
From: "R. Dennis Hager" <hager@aredee.com>

Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2009 08:49:55 
To: <aisdiscuss@aisboard.org>
Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] NO, DENNIS, we do NOT need a manager!


Terry,
I've read your post several times and have come to the conclusion that you 
have inadvertently exposed the seriousness of the organization's problems.

Buildings crumble, bridges to collapse and ships to sink. Yet, with perfect 
hindsight, the responsible people come up lines like "We always acted 
responsibly and appropriately to whatever situations we were confronted 
with."

Keep patting yourself on the back.


Dennis




----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Terry Aitken" <terry@flowerfantasy.net>
To: <aisdiscuss@aisboard.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 2:28 AM
Subject: RE: [AISdiscuss] DISASTER PLAN (One Giant Leap For....)


> Hi
> I like the "there he goes again" part.
>
> It is hard to reckon evolution with the e-world changes that we have never
> experienced before. Even national newspapers have not figured out how to
> deal with this "change".
> During the 15 or more years that I have observed the AIS board in action, 
> I
> have always felt that they (the board) have always acted responsibly and
> appropriately to whatever situations they were confronted with. A drop in
> membership has more to do with people being able to find the information
> they need without "joining" a society. I don't care what society.
> Resistance??? There is NO resistance. There never was "resistance".
>
> I am going to send forth, to the AIS board, the stated goals of the 
> American
> Orchid Society as published in their last bulletin. One is to increase
> membership but there is no clue as to how they are going to do this. -and
> they are paying this guy 6 figures to make that statement!!!???? There has
> got to be a chuckle in there somewhere. NO, DENNIS, we do NOT need a
> manager!
> Terry
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-aisdiscuss@aisboard.org [mailto:owner-aisdiscuss@aisboard.org]
> On Behalf Of aredee
> Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 8:06 AM
> To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] DISASTER PLAN (One Giant Leap For....)
>
> John, etal.
>
> There is no doubt that you have worked diligently to escort the AIS into 
> the
> electronic age--and considering the resistance along the way, it is
> incredible that the advances have been made.
>
> There are disasters, then there are disasters. The sensational disasters 
> are
> the ones that make the headlines. At this point, there are few people who 
> do
> not know about H1N1, or swine flu. It is sensational news. The peculiar
> thing is that the official estimates of death from influenza for this year
> forecast the deaths from seasonal influenza will be higher than those from
> H1N1.
>
> Some disasters occur rapidly, like Hurricane Floyd that flooded my Town.
> There are other disasters that are years in the making. They occur for
> multiple reasons. It's like watching a train wreck in slow motion.
>
> With declining membership and revenues, the AIS is in a slow-mo train 
> wreck.
> Hindsight is 20-20, but unfortunately, we don't seem to have hindsight 
> until
> we pick up the pieces. Does the Board wait until the dust has settled, or
> get to work on it now?
>
> There are many pieces flying at this point. Some of them need to be
> discarded. Others need to be brought back and remilled. A few days ago, I
> posted a short assessment of some of the problems with the Awards system.
> The silence has been deafening. There is no doubt that the AIS needs an
> Awards system. However, it must be conducted with integrity to produce
> results that are plausible, if not beyond question. That's just one small
> part of this great organization that needs to be addressed. By making each
> of the parts of the system stronger, the AIS may possibly survive the 
> train
> wreck.
>
> So, why has nobody responded?
>
> Is it because they agree and don't want to post the "ditto"? (for those,
> thank you for not posting to the group, but I really would like to know 
> what
> you are thinking--send me a personal note)
> Is it because they are too busy in the garden? (understandable--I'm busy
> too)
> Is it because they need to think about it a little longer? (keep
> thinking--but don't forget about it)
> Is it because it's too much work to change things? (Anything worth doing
> takes a lot of work)
> Is it because you think the Awards system is great? (If that is the case, 
> I
> recommend that you read "Mistakes Were Made (but not by me)--Why We 
> Justify
> Foolish Beliefs, Bad Decisions and Hurtful Acts", Harcourt Books 2007. It
> cost less than one new introduction and probably worth a hell of a lot 
> more)
> Is it because they're thinking "There HE goes again"? (I have thick
> skin--and I can take it)
>
> Dennis Hager
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John I Jones" <jijones@usjoneses.com>
> To: <aisdiscuss@aisboard.org>
> Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 1:22 AM
> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] DISASTER PLAN (One Giant Leap For....)
>
>
>> On Sep 16, 2009, at 6:35 AM, Robert Pries wrote:
>>
>>> Clarence and Dennis; The world has changed. In fact it seems like  we
>>> enter a
>>> quite different world every decade. I believe in lessons from  history
>>> but it
>>> is not often easy to figure them out.
>>
>>
>>> The AIS has remained pretty much the
>>> same despite the world changing around it.
>>
>> I am not sure I agree with that.
>>
>> We certainly are more electronically oriented now than when I first
>> became associated with the AIS ten years ago. Almost everyone on the
>> board, or in other responsible positions for the AIS has email, we  have
>> several electronic robins, one of which has been running since  February
>> of 1996. We have had electronic versions of the R&I, and  checklists 
>> since
>
>> I (and a dedicated team of helpers) started scanning  them in 1997 and a
>> full online registrations database when Mike Lowe  took over as 
>> Registrar.
>
>> We have AISDiscuss, AISVote, RVPs and  New  Regions email lists, we can
>> join or renew our memberships online with  Paypal, we have had a pretty
>> good website for over 6 years and an new  design in process, we have the
>> ability for anyone to go online and  see when their membership expires 
>> and
>
>> now a Wiki in process.
>>
>> So, NO I don't think we have stayed pretty much the same.
>>
>> Could we have done more, YES. Are we behind the curve, to be sure. We 
>> are
>
>> facing social changes and structural changes in lifestyles and  the
>> economy. It is sometimes hard to keep up when you have limited  finances
>> and even more limited human resources. Three years ago who  heard of
>> social networks and now we have Facebook. It is difficult  even for well
>> funded companies to keep up with all that has happened  in the last 7-10
>> years,
>>
>> Not that we shouldn't take steps to make our organization more  viable. 
>> We
>
>> should. But it is not that we have done nothing in the  last ten years.
>>
>> John
>>
>>> I do believe we have failed to keep
>>> up and this is why we are becoming less relevant. I am not sure an
>>> outside
>>> executive is the answer. After all if the board would not allow him  or
>>> her to
>>> make changes it would be useless. We have been working on strategic
>>> planning
>>> and soon will be soliciting input from RVPs and ultimately from
>>> everyone. At
>>> present no idea is off the table. To preserve the society there  will
>>> have to
>>> be a great deal of change. That does not mean the past is forgotton  but
>>> that
>>> our core values are reonforced and brought forward to new  generations
>>> they may
>>> not be touching now. To do this the society and its board must be
>>> willing to
>>> embrace changes that become necessary. I know that we will change,  we
>>> are at
>>> present with our decline in membership. Our challenge is to direct
>>> change in a
>>> productive way and not simply resist it. It is already happening  but we
>>> have
>>> lost control. There are actually promising changes in the works but  we
>>> are
>>> accomplishing them at a pace that continues to leave us behind the
>>> greater
>>> society.
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: cemahan@aol.com
>>> To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 8:48:59 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada
>>> Eastern
>>> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] DISASTER PLAN (One Giant Leap For....)
>>>
>>> The disaster was many years ago and involved the paid? secretary
>>> position in
>>> the permanent office set up in MO. I was not a member of AIS then,  but 
>>> I
>
>>> have
>>> heard many horror stories from "old-timers" over the years. If AIS  is
>>> not
>>> managing its finances well--an assertion that I have not heard 
>>> before--a
>
>>> new
>>> paid office will not correct the problem created by decisions of  the
>>> Board.
>>> Perhaps the problem is inadquate income. Perhaps the dues should be
>>> raised.
>>>
>>> Clarence Mahan
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: R. Dennis Hager <hager@aredee.com>
>>> To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
>>> Sent: Tue, Sep 15, 2009 8:48 pm
>>> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] DISASTER PLAN (One Giant Leap For....)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> What was the Board doing when the AIS had such a position? If it  was
>>> that bad,
>>> there was obviously no oversight.?
>>> ?
>>> Dennis Hager?
>>> ?
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: <cemahan@aol.com>?
>>> To: <aisdiscuss@aisboard.org>?
>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:06 AM?
>>> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] DISASTER PLAN (One Giant Leap For....)?
>>> ?
>>>> I cannot imagine a WORSE idea than for AIS to create a position  called
>>>> Operations Director or Executive Director. AIS had one experience  with
>>>> such
>>>> a position and based on what the person did came close to going  out of
>>>> business.? It took years and years to recover.?Anything such a 
>>>> position
>
>>>> can
>>>> do can be done by the President or?First Vice President if the  Board
>>>> wishes
>>>> to delegate its responsibilities. Clarence Mahan??
>>>> ?
>>>> ?
>>>> -----Original Message-----?
>>>> From: R. Dennis Hager <hager@aredee.com>?
>>>> To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org?
>>>> Sent: Tue, Sep 15, 2009 8:07 am?
>>>> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] DISASTER PLAN (One Giant Leap For....)?
>>>> ?
>>>> ?
>>>> I hope I am not jumping the gun here, but it wouldn't be the first
>>>> time. >
>>> What the position should be called does matter, but now it is more
>>> > important
>>> that the position is created, well-defined and RECOGNIZED for > its
>>> importance, just as Editor, Membership Secretary and Registrar are >
>>> recognized. To be a little more direct, it should be a paid  position.??
>>>> ??
>>>> I am told that the AIS finances are abysmal, but so are the  finances 
>>>> of
>
>>>>  >
>>> many businesses, government entities and individuals. In these  economic
>>>  >
>>> times, there are a lot of talented individuals out there looking  for
>>> work >
>>> and now it the time to create and fill this position. (Actually, it
>>> should >
>>> have happened 20 years ago, but it's still not too late.) The long  term
>>>  >
>>> health of the society depends on it. The ideal candidate should  have
>>> good >
>>> writing and communications skills, as well as a working knowledge of >
>>> information systems. A passion for irises should not be a  prerequisite
>>> for >
>>> the position, but a passion for quality should. "People skills"  would
>>> also >
>>> be at the top of the list. (I added that just so none of you would 
>>> think
>
>>>  >
>>> that I'm looking for a job.)??
>>>> ??
>>>> If indeed the AIS Board members were ever to take so brave a step  as 
>>>> to
>
>>>>  >
>>> create, FUND and fill this position, the title that goes with it  would
>>> be >
>>> part of the pay, just as Wal-Mart has "associates" and every bank  seems
>>> to >
>>> have more "vice-presidents" than tellers. Although "Operations 
>>> Director"
>
>>>  > has
>>> a nice ring to it, "Executive Director" has an even better one.??
>>>> ??
>>>> I'm not sure which direction this discussion will go, but I hope  that
>>>> it >
>>> goes somewhere. I post this with the full understanding that  finances
>>> are >
>>> tight and there is risk involved, but I just hope and pray that  there
>>> are >
>>> enough board members who have the foresight and understanding to  see
>>> that >
>>> this is about the ultimate survival of the organization.??
>>>> ??
>>>> Back in my little hole.??
>>>> ??
>>>> Dennis Hager??
>>>> ??
>>>> ??
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: <MORRISJE1@aol.com>??
>>>> To: <aisdiscuss@aisboard.org>??
>>>> Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 9:26 PM??
>>>> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] DISASTER PLAN??
>>>> ??
>>>>> In a message dated 9/14/2009 6:28:45 P.M. Central Standard Time,??
>>>>> ritagormley@yahoo.com writes:??
>>>>> ??
>>>>> Bob, Operations Manager sounds like a reasonable thing to do
>>>>> especially >
>>>>> the??
>>>>> part that Jody outlines.??
>>>>> ??
>>>>> "Just as an aside we might consider an ombudsman that could help
>>>>> > >>
>>> affiliates??
>>>>> coordinate with AIS." We already have an RVP Respresentative  working 
>>>>>  >
>
>>>>>  >>
>>> with??
>>>>> the??
>>>>> RVP Counselor for that function. But you really already knew tha!??
>>>>> ??
>>>>> Rita??
>>>>> ??
>>>>> ??
>>>>> ??
>>>>>
>>> **********************************************************************
>>> ******?
>>> ?
>>>>> *********??
>>>>> Bob,??
>>>>> ??
>>>>> I agree with Rita that Operations Manager sounds reasonable.??
>>>>> ??
>>>>> As to an "ombudsman" my experience in both industry and volunteer
>>>>> > >>
>>> societies??
>>>>> is that after appointment there is an initial flurry of  complaints >>
>>> brought??
>>>>> up with little resolution, followed by benign neglect and the
>>>>> eventual??
>>>>> fading away of enthusiasm and any belief in change and then the
>>>>> position >>
>>>> dies.??
>>>>> I have seen this time and time again even with top management
>>>>> support.??
>>>>> ??
>>>>> Jim M.??
>>>>> ??
>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> -??
>>>>> To sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary??
>>>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>??
>>>>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:??
>>>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/??
>>>> ??
>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> ??
>>>> To sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary??
>>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>??
>>>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:??
>>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/??
>>>> ?
>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> ?
>>>> To sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary?
>>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>?
>>>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:?
>>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/?
>>> ?
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------?
>>> To sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary?
>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>?
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>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/?
>>>
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>>>
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>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
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References:
- RE: DISASTER PLAN (One Giant Leap For....)
  - From: "Terry Aitken" <terry@flowerfantasy.net>
- Re: NO, DENNIS, we do NOT need a manager!
  - From: "R. Dennis Hager" <hager@aredee.com>
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