RE: Motion to remove the operations manual from the Wiki

[RON AND SUSAN COSNER <keighley15@msn.com>]

Do not know if we have to or if we are voting but I like Gary White's amended
motion and vote yes for this
Thank you and happy gardening
Ron Cosner


> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] Motion to remove the operations manual from the
Wiki
> From: jijones@usjoneses.com
> Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 10:06:46 -0700
> To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
>
> HI Susan,
>
> I have often asked to have those who know they are going to prepare motions
draft them in electronic form and send them to me so I don't have to type them
(in my slow error prone style) for the big screen. A few do, but a lot of our
motions are drafted on the spot.
>
> Things do sometimes get out of control at the meetings, but a lot of times
to, people wait to be called on.
>
> Thanks
>
> John
> __________________
> John and Joanne Jones
> Registrar-Recorders, American Iris Society
> aisregistrar@irises.org
>
> John Jones, Chairman, Electronic Services Committee
> aiselectronicsvcs@irises.org
>
> 35572 Linda Drive
> Fremont, CA 94536
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mar 14, 2013, at 8:48 AM, Susan Grigg wrote:
>
> > I agree in part with Gary and with John; however, it would be to the
Board's
> > advantage if committees worked so well that motions that needed to be
> > brought to the Board from a committee were prepared ahead of time,
presented
> > with the committee report, and any necessary amendments done then. Does
it
> > just involve too much typing or are our committees not functioning well?
> >
> > Why can't we at least raise hands to be recognized by the President
before
> > we speak during the Board meeting? Discussions are dominated by anyone
who
> > talks fast and loud.
> >
> > Susan Grigg
> >
> > "Where there is no law, but every man does what is right in his own eyes,
> > there is the least of real liberty."
> > Henry M. Robert
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
[mailto:owner-aisdiscuss@aisboard.org]
> > On Behalf Of gary white
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:16 PM
> > To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
> > Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] Motion to remove the operations manual from the
> > Wiki
> >
> > I agree with all that John has posted below concerning the way we handle
> > motions at our spring and fall board meetings. While it has not been
> > exactly by Robert's Rules of Order, it has usually worked well in the
board
> > meeting situation, and sometimes there is a need for considerable
discussion
> > on a particular topic and there may be several of what Robert's Rules
refers
> > to as "friendly amendments" on an abbreviated basis. These usually get to
> > the same result as if we took the much longer route and made multiple
> > amendments, voted on the motions to amend, then voted on the amended
> > motions. The easiest way out and still follow Robert's Rules is to make
> > suggestions for revision as the motion is being written, but before the
> > President announces the motion for discussion. After that, we may not be
> > strictly following RR, but as John indicates, it has worked well for us
when
> > there are "friendly amendments".
> >
> > But, it is not so easy to do this with electronic motions, especially
when
> > there may be differing opinions and views on a motion. There is not the
> > same ability for all to review the motion and make suggestions for
revision
> > before it is announced for discussion. There is, by necessity, a
prolonged
> > discussion and voting time with electronic motions, and there is not the
> > same ability to expediently discuss and compromise, etc as at a live
board
> > meeting.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Gary
> >
> > --- On Wed, 3/13/13, John Jones <jijones@usjoneses.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: John Jones <jijones@usjoneses.com>
> > Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] Motion to remove the operations manual from the
> > Wiki
> > To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
> > Date: Wednesday, March 13, 2013, 1:08 PM
> >
> >
> > It is true that Article 10, Section 3 of the AIS By-Laws (4-04-11)
states:
> > "The parliamentary rules contained in the most recent edition of Robert's
> > Rules of Order shall be used in all meetings of the AIS to cover
questions
> > not provided for in these bylaws."
> >
> > We may have been playing a little "fast and loose" with Roberts Rules
(RRs)
> > in the process of making and discussing motions, but I think that what
> > evolved over the last several years serves us pretty well. The whole
point
> > of having motions displayed on the big screen and modifying them as
directed
> > by the board was to help ensure that the motion gets worded properly to
> > effect the action that the board wants. While this may engender a little
> > more non-RRs discussion, I believe that it saves time in that we don't
have
> > to vote to reject a motion only to have it resubmitted in a revised
manner,
> > changed again etc. None of use are exceptionally adept at constructing
> > perfect motions the first time and this provides a reasonable process for
us
> > to use. Changes are accepted by the originator and seconder prior to a
vote
> > being taken.
> >
> > Certainly there are times when discussions drag on but most often they
> > proceed pretty quickly. There are lost of times when someone's comment
> > brings up an idea for someone that has already spoken and I think that
the
> > often short period of open discussion we have used in the past serves to
> > bring us all to better conclusions. The AIS President maintains control
of
> > the meeting and can end the discussion if needed or a motion made to Call
> > the Question
> >
> > With the exception of one meeting (when I was in the hospital) I have
served
> > as Motions Secretary at the pleasure of the Board since we started doing
> > this at the Fall 2004 Board meeting. While the process is not strictly
> > according to RRs, I think that it serves the intent behind those rules in
> > that we accomplish a lot in the period of time that we use. certainly in
the
> > last 7-8 years we have have has progressively shorter meetings while
still
> > getting the business done that we need done.
> >
> > I don't mean to imply that we should continue doing something just
because
> > that is the way we have done it in the past. We should always be
accepting
> > of doing things a new way that serves us better,
> >
> >
> > John
> > __________________
> > John and Joanne Jones
> > Registrar-Recorders, American Iris Society aisregistrar@irises.org
> >
> > John Jones, Chairman, Electronic Services Committee
> > aiselectronicsvcs@irises.org
> >
> > 35572 Linda Drive
> > Fremont, CA 94536
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mar 13, 2013, at 10:13 AM, Ron Killingsworth wrote:
> >
> >> Michelle, you are correct, the board of AIS usually brings up an idea,
> >> talks
> > about it, works out the kinks and details, then someone makes a motion,
> > someone seconds it, and then the board votes. Technically, nothing is
> > supposed to be discussed by the board unless there is a seconded motion
> > before the board. This cuts down on a lot of talking and discussion and
> > also stops discussion on an idea of only one person. I agree that
> > conducting a meeting by a strict interpretation of Robert's Rules of
Order
> > can make it complicated.
> > However, I really think that the board should at least follow the general
> > guidelines of Robert's Rules. The rules actually limit the discussion of
a
> > motion -- i.e., once a person expresses his/her opinion on the motion,
that
> > person can not again have the floor until everyone has had a chance to
> > express an opinion and unless it is agreed by all to extend the
discussion.
> >> Again, this can get real complicated. But, following the basic rules
> >> of
> > Roberts will help the meetings to run smoother and cut out some of the
two
> > hour discussions on a simple matter such as publishing the 2014 calendar.
> >>
> >> If the original motion maker and the seconder is willing to change the
> > motion to something resembling my amendment, I am willing to withdraw my
> > amendment (if the person who seconded it agrees) and to allow the amended
by
> > the original people motion to proceed with discussion.
> >>
> >> Ron
> >> Director, AIS
> >> Adv Editor
> >>
> >> On 3/13/2013 12:04, Michelle Snyder wrote:
> >>> I only have the revised 10 edition and it isn't the easiest to
> >>> understand,
> > at least not to this lay person. Anyway, for as far back as I can
remember,
> > we have always allowed the members to voice their opinion on an existing
> > motion regarding changes but we have also had the changes agreed to by
the
> > original motion maker and the second, or the originators have agreed to
> > withdraw their motion. From what I see from Gary's email, it appears
while
> > the motion is pending it can be amended several times during the
discussion
> > process. It appears this could drag out motions for a very long time. If
> > we accept the motion to amend as presented, that amended motion would
have
> > to go through the discussion and voting period (two weeks) and then the
> > original motion, possibly as amended, would have to go through the same
> > process. This seems like it would stop any motion from going forward in a
> > reasonable time frame. Perhaps we should discuss this further at the
> > spring board meeting a!
> > nd Jim could contact our legal adviser and she could present a definitive
> > explanation of how this should work. Have we been doing our amendments to
> > pending motions wrong all along?
> >>>
> >>> During our Spring and Fall board meetings motions have been amended a
> >>> lot
> > before being voted on.
> >>>
> >>> Michelle
> >>
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> >>
> >
> >
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