Re: AIS Website

To: "aisdiscuss@aisboard.org" <aisdiscuss@aisboard.org>
Subject: Re: AIS Website
From: Debra Strauss <ccb528001@rewrite.aisboard.org>
Date: Wed, 4 Jun 2014 13:00:55 -0500
Old-from: Debra Strauss <debrastrauss@outlook.com>
I bet John already has it figured out. 

Debbie
debrastrauss@outlook.com
Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 4, 2014, at 12:28 PM, "Robert Pries " <101p@rewrite.aisboard.org> wrote:
> 
> What is wrong with the idea of spending the time to decide on a menu before
> paying for it. If it makes sense than everyone would support it. I hate paying
> for surprise packages.
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: "Michelle Snyder" <7de114421@rewrite.aisboard.org>
> To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
> Cc: "aisdiscuss" <aisdiscuss@aisboard.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, June 4, 2014 12:47:05 PM
> Subject: RE: [AISdiscuss] AIS Website
> 
> 
> Bravo Susan.B  I agree completely.B 
> Michelle
> 
> Sent using CloudMagic
> 
> On Wed, Jun 04, 2014 at 9:24 AM, Susan Boyce < 100T@rewrite.aisboard.org >
> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi all,
> B B  To table this motion at this time is wrong.B  We are not even 24 hours
> into
> a 7 day discussion.B  We know what we are funding.B  We don't need to research
> this to death in order to update the website.B  I say let the 7 day discussion
> continue.
> Susan Boyce
> 
>> Date: Wed, 4 Jun 2014 11:55:26 -0400
>> To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
>> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] AIS Website
>> From: 101p@rewrite.aisboard.org
>> 
>> As I have said before I wish we had our own data on the AIS website to
> digest. But not having that one can turn to a service like Alexa that gives
> data it collects. Free data is limited but Alexa does give global Rankings.
> (The lower the number, the higher the ranking). The rankings bounce around a
> lot from month to month but they give some idea of how we are doing in
> comparison to other sites. Unfortunately ALEXA does not separate the Website
> from the wiki so all data is for both because the wiki is a subdomain. ALEXA
> does show that 82% of the traffic ultimately heads to the wiki.
>> 
>> So how are we doing compared to other sites? The AIS website is globally
> ranked 250,994, so there are that many websites that get more traffic than we
> do. We do better than all the websites that Andi mentioned with the exception
> of the Huntington at 187,320; (Descanso-487,730), (Presby-4,711,278),
> (Butchart-557,009) and (Arboretum-992,788). If one compares the daily page
> views/ visitor one sees 4.6; 3.5; 1.3; 2.9; and 3.8 respectively while the
> Irises get a whopping 13.0. With an average of 9.55 minutes for each visit our
> visits spend over 3 times the amount of time looking at the combined Iris
> sites. Of course this is mixing apples and oranges and the wiki is incredibly
> content dense compared to these other sites.
>> 
>> Perhaps it more fair to compare to other plant societies; the Hemerocallis
> Society ranks 740,568; the Daffodil Society 2,595,913; The American Rose
> Society 673,746; the American Orchid Society 369,768 and visitors spend about
> one fourth the time they spend on the Iris Site.
>> So we are not doing badly. We are undoubtedly servicing various groups. The
> question at hand is how can we guide visitors to material they would find of
> interest. The words used for the links are important. I do not agree that one
> person should make those decisions. What we have now maybe intuitive to John
> but not to me.
>> 
>> I do not feel AIS has ever thought through who we want to appeal to with the
> website and how we would go about doing it well. If we want new members we
> need to demonstrate visually on our website the benefits of membership. So I
> agree with Andi that beauty is important also. I think jumping at a thought is
> not appropriate in this case and I MOVE TO TABLE THE MOTION until we can
> discuss what these concrete steps should be. I do not see where there would be
> any problem funding if we knew what we were funding.
>> 
>> 
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "John Jones" <100h@rewrite.aisboard.org>
>> To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
>> Sent: Wednesday, June 4, 2014 10:58:52 AM
>> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] AIS Website
>> 
>> Actually I had not designed a new layout yet. It is difficult to architect a
> navigation scheme and I thought it better to know that a new scheme could be
> implemented before spending the effort to research and design a new
> architecture. Additionally, until the revision of the layout is undertaken we
> cannot know for sure how many additional items we could have.
>> 
>> When we first did the new website design the Board reviewed and approved the
> navigation architecture. I intend to go through the same process of soliciting
> input, presenting, and iterating as often as needed until the board is
> satisfied that the navigation it what they want. There will never be an
> architecture that satisfies everyone. I pay attention to critics, obviously,
> or I would not have embarked on this process. It is also true that people that
> are satisfied with something rarely say so. The ones that are unhappy speak up
> (or at least we hope they do). It is the negative comments that prompt us to
> consider the issues, make revisions and try to get better. That is not to say
> that there should be a knee-jerk reaction to anything, but rather a considered
> response.
>> 
>> ThereB  is no hidden agenda here.
>> 
>> Thanks
>> 
>> John
>> __________________
>> John and Joanne Jones
>> Registrar-Recorders, American Iris Society
>> aisregistrar@irises.org
>> 
>> John Jones, Chairman, Electronic Services Committee
>> aiselectronicsvcs@irises.org
>> 
>> 35572 Linda Drive
>> Fremont, CA 94536
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jun 4, 2014, at 6:06 AM, "Robert Pries " <101p@rewrite.aisboard.org>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> I am not against the change, but the last time we changed most people
> found the titles of the left bar difficult to understand and as to what would
> be under each. It is not an easy task to create a title that represents what
> is under it. I would suggest that it just makes sense to let everyone see what
> the new proposed titles and their categories are so that if possible the best
> words could be chosen. In this case it would be better to review these words
> before we spend the money to insert them.
>>> 
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Judy Keisling" <a3f86f581@rewrite.aisboard.org>
>>> To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 4, 2014 8:10:03 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] AIS Website
>>> 
>>> I agree that this change should be made.B  What John is proposing will
> make
>>> navigating the site more user friendly.
>>> 
>>> Regarding the cost, while we could
>>> probably get some one to make this change at a reduced cost, from my
> working
>>> experience I can tell you that whenever you use a company/person other
> than
>>> the original developer to modify a website, application, program, etc.
> the
>>> seemingly lower cost turns into a higher cost and something usually
> breaks.
>>> As John points out - this is not a redesign, simply an upgrade (there is
> a
>>> difference).B  And, as he also points out, the expense does not affect the
> AIS
>>> operating budget one way or another.
>>> 
>>> I say, let's go for this change.
>>> 
>>> Judy
>>> Keisling
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Wednesday, June 4, 2014 6:45 AM, Robert Pries
>>> <101p@rewrite.aisboard.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Cost is not my only concern. I would
>>> like to know what the topic arrangement of the left bar would be. You
> have
>>> suggested 4 extra topics, presumably rearranged from the topics that are
>>> already treed on the left bar now. Why donbt you tell us the new
> arrangement.
>>> If you know what you want to do it should be easy to present it as an
> outline.
>>> Then we could make a rational decision as to whether it is worth the cost
> and
>>> the effort. I see no reason to approve something nebulous since to do it
> you
>>> must know what it is you want to do.
>>> 
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "John
>>> Jones" <100h@rewrite.aisboard.org>
>>> To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
>>> Sent:
>>> Wednesday, June 4, 2014 2:15:37 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] AIS Website
>>> Everyone seems to be concerned the cost.
>>> 
>>> Please note that I said "not to
>>> exceed" $1200. I also believe in planning for contingencies. The bid from
> the
>>> developer was $720. I added $480 for contingencies and additional changes
> that
>>> may up come up.
>>> 
>>> In any case the new Electronic Services Chair is going to
>>> have to deal with the current website until a new website (if authorized)
> is
>>> in place.
>>> 
>>> Thanks
>>> 
>>> John
>>> __________________
>>> John and Joanne Jones
>>> Registrar-Recorders, American Iris Society
>>> aisregistrar@irises.org
>>> 
>>> John
>>> Jones, Chairman, Electronic Services Committee
>>> aiselectronicsvcs@irises.org
>>> 35572 Linda Drive
>>> Fremont, CA 94536
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "John Jones" <100h@rewrite.aisboard.org>
>>>> To: <aisdiscuss@aisboard.org>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2014 1:21 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] AIS Website
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Well I am sorry, but your IT people are not graphic designers and
>>> frankly have no clue what all has to be done to the graphics to
> accommodate a
>>> longer menu list. The list code is custom designed to fit with our look
> and
>>> feel. The software used it up to date and from reputable companies.
>>>> 
>>>> You
>>> are correct the websites that Andi referenced are very pretty. It is also
> true
>>> that they don't have anywhere as much information to present as we do.
>>> Navigation is a significant problem and we provided a reasonable solution
> that
>>> is accessible on the home page and is most cases does not require going
> to
>>> another page to find where something is.
>>>> 
>>>> I never intended to "put my
>>> mark" on a website. I intended to present a website that reflected the
> style
>>> and needs of AIS, and despite one or two perennial detractors, did so in
> a
>>> manner that reflects the image the board wanted.
>>>> 
>>>> If the board wants a
>>> redesign, I am all for it, but I do not have the time to undertake the
> effort
>>> to incorporate a new structure and revise all the information that we
> present
>>> today. I am sure we will hear how all the information should be on the
> wiki,
>>> but the wiki is not the AIS, has a look that could be best described as
>>> confounding, and has its own significant difficulties for anyone trying
> to
>>> search for something.
>>>> 
>>>> If the board does not want to improve the current
>>> site with money from the ESC Restricted fund raised primarily by the Geek
>>> Dinner auctions, then that can be their decision. This effort would not
> affect
>>> the AIS General budget in any way.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks
>>>> 
>>>> John
>>> __________________
>>>> John and Joanne Jones
>>>> Registrar-Recorders, American
>>> Iris Society
>>>> aisregistrar@irises.org
>>>> 
>>>> John Jones, Chairman, Electronic
>>> Services Committee
>>>> aiselectronicsvcs@irises.org
>>>> 
>>>> 35572 Linda Drive
>>> Fremont, CA 94536
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Jun 3, 2014, at 12:46 PM, "Robert Pries
>>>> " <101p@rewrite.aisboard.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> I did some checking with some IT
>>> people. What John is proposing could be done
>>>>> at half the cost. And it
>>> actually could be done at the $60 I was suggesting if
>>>>> the website was
>>> running on todaybs state of the art software. But the
>>>>> website is outdated
>>> and making the changes suggested would actually cost about
>>>>> $600 keeping it
>>> running on the same static system.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I agree with Andi; the websites he
>>> displayed are GREAT!!!! Ours should look
>>>>> that good. But I do not think we
>>> have the personnel capable of making those
>>>>> changes. I do believe we should
>>> have the new electronics chair tackle this
>>>>> problem and not someone who is
>>> leaving. BB  New people like to place their own
>>>>> mark on something and
>>> certainly there is a need.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Ron Killingsworth" <102w@rewrite.aisboard.org>
>>>>> To:
>>> aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 3, 2014 3:07:10 PM
>>>>> Subject:
>>> Re: Fwd: RE: [AISdiscuss] AIS Website
>>>>> 
>>>>> I agree with Bob Pries that the
>>> price seems high to me - but admit I am no web
>>>>> site guru.BB  Seems we should
>>> have some computer experts within our
>>>>> organization who could make small
>>> changes to the web site -- ok, this may not
>>>>> be a small change -- what do I
>>> know? - but again I think that's a lot of money
>>>>> honey.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Second, I
>>> agree with Andi that we should not rush into making changes for
>>>>> cosmetic
>>> reasons.BB  Have there been complaints about the menus?BB  Would Bob
>>>>> Pries
>>> ideas be better?
>>>>> I looked at all the web sites Andi suggested and wow, we
>>> are really have a
>>>>> model A ford website compared to those web sites.BB  I can
>>> think of many great
>>>>> pictures that could fill the beginning page of the web
>>> site, like the web
>>>>> sites Andi suggested looking over, and yet our site has
>>> such a bland first
>>>>> page.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Third, I agree with Jim Morris that the new
>>> "electronic services chairperson"
>>>>> should be involved in this discussion.B
>>> The question is:BB  Are the changes
>>>>> worth the money?
>>>>> 
>>>>> So, I guess I am
>>> saying I feel this needs more study and that if we are going
>>>>> to update the
>>> front page, maybe we could really update it to include a better
>>>>> visual
>>> picture of who we are. And, to me it makes no difference where the
>>>>> money is
>>> coming from, out of the left pocket or out of the right pocket, we
>>>>> are
>>> still looking at a lot of money at a time when the budget seems to be
>>> running over.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Ron Killingsworth, Director
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 6/3/2014 13:56,
>>> Michelle Snyder wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hello all,
>>>>> Since I am traveling until
>>> late Thursday, I am forwarding the made and
>>>>> seconded motion for official
>>> discussion via my cell phone.
>>>>> Michelle
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sent using CloudMagic
>>> --------Forwarded message--------
>>>>> From: Susan Boyce <
>>> 100T@rewrite.aisboard.org >
>>>>> Date: Tue, Jun 03, 2014 at 11:30 AM
>>>>> Subject:
>>> Fwd: RE: [AISdiscuss] AIS Website
>>>>> To: aisdiscuss < aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> <blockquote>
>>>>> 
>>>>> I second the motion.
>>>>> Susan Boyce
>>>>> 
>>> To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
>>>>>> Subject: [AISdiscuss] AIS Website
>>>>>> Date:
>>> Tue, 3 Jun 2014 11:00:11 -0700
>>>>>> From: c95039e11@rewrite.aisboard.org
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I move "That the AIS Board approve an upgrade to the AIS Website to
>>> increase
>>>>>> the number of menu items available on the left side area of the
>>> webpage.
>>>>> Such
>>>>>> upgrade not to exceed a cost of $1200.00, funding is to
>>> come from the
>>>>>> Electronic Services Restricted Fund.BB  Such upgrade to be
>>> managed by the
>>>>>> Electronic Services Chair on behalf of AIS."
>>>>>> Cheryl
>>> Deaton
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>> To
>>> sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>
>>>>>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> To
>>> sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>
>>>>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- To
>>> sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary The archives for
>>> AISDiscuss are at: http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To
>>>>> sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary The archives for
>>> 
>>> AISDiscuss are at: http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> To
>>> sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>
>>>>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> To
>>> sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>
>>>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> To
>>> sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>
>>>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To
>>> sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>
>>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To
>>> sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>
>>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
>>> 
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>
>>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
>>> 
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
>>> <aissecretary@irises.org>
>>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
>>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
>> 
>> 
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
>> <aissecretary@irises.org>
>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
>> 
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
>> <aissecretary@irises.org>
>> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
>> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
> <aissecretary@irises.org>
> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
> 
> </blockquote>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------- To
> sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary The archives for
> AISDiscuss are at: http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To sign-off this list, send email to the AIS Secretary
> <aissecretary@irises.org>
> The archives for AISDiscuss are at:
> http://www.aisboard.org/lists/aisdiscuss/

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References:
- Re: AIS Website
  - From: "Robert Pries " <101p@rewrite.aisboard.org>
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