Re: Motion regarding foreign registrations

[andi rivarola <andinsky@gmail.com>]

Hey John, thanks for the explanation. I find your points very detailed and
more clear for me to understand being a newbie.

I have some questions, but the Board may have already explored them.

AIS seems to need to clarify its own role on this. I understand that we need
to cover our own expenses, but as we have taken the role of World registrar
for irises that many years ago, we need to see each country, and each
hybridizer in other countries as a brother/sister that speaks another
language, that's all. Would we raise prices on our own? I mean, they are
already paying a fee.

A- So, my first question is: do we want -- to continue -- to be the world
registrar for all irises? And if so, are we being impartial by -- basically
-- raising the price for foreign registrations only.

B- Instead or raising prices, which will end up costing the little guy/gal
everywhere more to register, and discourage registration (a main goal to our
worldwide role) couldn't funds be raised in a different way? Could we find a
sponsor to cover registration costs? I mean, since we don't suppose to make
a profit, it would be nice to ask someone (a company) that can afford it It
would worth the effort to try to find someone. Discover a new source of
income!

C- Even though we were/are consulting with foreign registrars, who we are
really affecting are the foreign hybridizers. Aren't we? Should we consult
with them? Again, shouldn't we then treat them as a U.S. hybridizer (that
speaks are foreign language) and think of them equally? I mean, they are
already paying a fee.

D- The possible perception at foreign countries that we're treating them
differently because they need to pay more in order to register their iris
create a descent by foreign hybridizers? Have we thoroughly thought of the
the consequences if this was they case?

Again, you may have all already discussed these points, but they came to
mind.

Thanks for taking the time to read these.

Andi Rivarola
PS: Writing while enjoying a beautiful raising sun at Yellowstone National
Park, WY.


On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 11:44 PM, John Jones <jijones@usjoneses.com> wrote:

> I think we need to clarify some issues and put some things in perspective.
>
>
> 1: While AIS was not receiving any money for registrations from foreign
> hybridizers, that does not mean that they were not paying a fee to register
> their iris (to their Country Associate Registrar). In fact, almost all
> foreign registrants paid a fee, as enumerated on one of my previous posts.
>
>
> 2: AIS is not supposed to make a profit by charging for registrations. The
> ICRA allows Registrars to charge a fee to COVER COSTS. It was not the intent
> of the original motion to charge foreign registrants a fee in  order to
> "balance the AIS Books."
>
> 3: Because we were not charging foreign registrants, we were in a deficit
> condition based of current expenses, specifically:
>
> Registrar's salary (annual)  $9600.00
> Approximate costs for shipping, postage, paper, toner, and other office
> costs:  $900.00
> 5 year depreciation schedule for Registrar's computer system:  $1300.00
>  (aprox)
>
> Total annual costs:  $11,800
>
> Assuming for the point of discussion that there are 600 registrations
> annually from North America and 700 from other countries.
>
> If the AIS were to receive $15.00 from each registrant that would generate
> $19,500 far exceeding out costs. And before anyone jumps in and says "yes
> but we have to print the R&Is and Checklists", that is true but we make a
> profit on that as well.
>
> Remember also that before the Board decided to charge foreign registrants
> we would only receive 600 X $15.00 or $9000.00 (less than our current costs.
>
> 4: The real point of my current motion is to recognize that foreign
> registrants, under the current fee structure, would be paying more (in
> almost every case) than North American registrants (the AIS $15.00 AIS fee
> plus their country Associate fee). My current motion is an attempt to
> mitigate that issue.
>
> The foreign Iris Societies set the fee that the Associate Registrars
> charge. Whether that fee goes to the Associate Registrar or not is their
> business, not ours. Remember that the AIS pays their Registrar  (me) a fee
> supported by the fee charged to registrants.
>
> As i detailed in a previous post, the Associate Registrars provide a
> valuable service to me, making my job much easier. (Note that that is a
> relative statement. The job of Registrar is still very difficult. Even
> dealing with some of the North American registrants is a challenge...)
>
> Before we worry too much about giving away $5.00 per foreign registration,
> remember that 45 days ago we weren't getting anything from them. We need to
> try to be as fair and even handed to everyone as we can. We also need to
> have a uniform approach to all foreign countries. We can't  have different
> standards for different countries or people.
>
> In receiving $10.00 per foreign registration we will generate an additional
> estimated $7000.00 for a total registrations revenue of $16,000 which is
> still in excess (significantly) of our estimated costs. Even if we adopt my
> "fee sharing" approach, the fee foreign registrants pay will go up from what
> they are accustomed  to paying and I believe that additional fee will cause
> the number of foreign registrations to diminish to some degree, but
> obviously I have no specific data to support that.
>
> Also if we don't allocate $5.00 of the $15.00 dollar registration fee to
> the associate registrar (thus reducing the total cost to the registrant) we
> may find that foreign registrants just stop registering irises (which is the
> antithesis of our purpose). There is also some concern that some other
> country may petition the ICRA to become the World Wide Registrar for
> non-Bulbous Irises and the all North American registrants would end up
> sending registration requests to some foreign country just as a result of
> our raising the fee at all.
>
> So far I have had two responses to a recent email to all foreign Associate
> Registrars describing my revenue sharing approach:
>
> Jean Peyrard of France: "I agree it's a good solution, I transfer to the
> French Society",
>
> Sergey Loktev of Russia: "I consider the suggestion logical".
>
>
> As to Susan's questions, my comments are interspersed below.
>
> John
>
> On Aug 19, 2011, at 12:10 PM, Susan Boyce wrote:
>
> >  Hi all,
> >    Now that I am home from work, I can finally sit down and put my
> thoughts
> > into words about this.
> > In my opinion, I would like to find out some more information before I
> would
> > vote to send $5.00 to the associate registrars in other countries.
> > 1.   Does the money the foreign associates receive go into their own
> pockets,
> > or does it go into their respective iris societies coiffers.
>
> answered above
>
> >  I would really
> > hate to see us send an extra $5.00 just to end up in someone's pocket.
>
> Remember that AIS pays me to be Registrar from registration revenues.
> Foreign Associate Registrars are performing a service at the behest of their
> respective Iris Societies. They deserve, under the rules of the ICRA, to
> charge a fee to mitigate their costs. But because they do and because we
> have decided to charge foreign registrants a fee, the registrants are faced
> with paying a double fee. That is not particularly fair and it is what I am
> attempting to mitigate (among other reasons) with my motion. To as great an
> extent as possible, we should create an environment where by all registrants
> face the same fee structure. Granted given all the various economies and
> specific country variations, we will never have perfect uniformity, but we
> can do our best.
>
> > 2.   What exactly does the foreign associates do?
>
> Described in an other email
>
> > Do they just forward the
> > registrations onto us?  Do they translate effectively and/or correctly
> the
> > registrations before sending them to us?
>
> Some translate more effectively than others, but certainly better than I
> could. Plus they add experience as to how to describe an iris clone and
> correct/clarify the registrations.
>
> >   All of these questions should be answered before we should vote on any
> > changes.
> > Susan Boyce
> >
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> >
> >> Subject: Re: [AISdiscuss] Motion regarding foreign registrations
> >> From: jijones@usjoneses.com
> >> Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2011 15:55:46 -0700
> >> To: aisdiscuss@aisboard.org
> >>
> >> The whole point of having a discussion after a motion is made is to get
> > thoughts on the table and vet the subject.
> >>
> >> HOW ABOUT SPEAKING UP!
> >>
> >> John
> >>
> >> On Aug 16, 2011, at 12:47 PM, Michelle Snyder wrote:
> >>
> >>> John Jones moved and Cheryl Deaton seconded the below motion. As such
> it
> > is open for discussion.
> >>>
> >>> "That each foreign registrant pay a fee of USD$15.00 (or its equivalent
> in
> > the country currency) per iris registration or iris name reservation to
> the
> > country Associate Registrar. That the country Associate Registrar keep
> > USD$5.00 (or its equivalent in the country currency) per iris
> registration or
> > iris name reservation and pay the AIS USD$10.00 per iris registration or
> iris
> > name reservation, such payments to the AIS to be made via a PayPal system
> or
> > such other arrangements as may be enumerated by the AIS
> Registrar-Recorder for
> > his convenience. All payments to the AIS registrar to be made in USD. The
> AIS
> > respectfully requests, but does not require, the country Associate
> Registrars
> > to accept the USD$5.00 stipend as full payment for their services as
> Associate
> > Register in managing iris registrations and iris name reservations. That
> the
> > services of the country Associate Registrar include, but may not be
> limited
> > to, iris name checking against the irisregister.com database, !
> >> translation (as appropriate), transliteration (as appropriate), and
> > description review ad editing.
> >>>
> >>> Michelle Snyder,
> >>> AIS Secretary
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
>
> __________________
> John I Jones
> Registrar-Recorder
> American Iris Society
> aisregistrar@irises.org
>
>
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